Nomura discusses Kingdom Hearts 4, Missing-Link, and Dark Road in extended Famitsu interview
- Details
- Published on April 27, 2022 @ 03:29 pm
- Written by Sign
Famitsu has published their extended interview with Tetsuya Nomura, covering the Kingdom Hearts series's 20th anniversary and event, as well as the newly announced Kingdom Hearts IV and Missing-Link.
We've omitted the Q&A that was already published in the web interview.
-- I was surprised by the faithful recreation of the area surrounding Shibuya Hikarie, the venue in which the event took place, in the Kingdom Hearts 4 trailer. The video was rendered in Unreal Engine 4, but with development moving to Unreal Engine 5, it seems that the graphics will become even more impressive.
Nomura: Currently, we've already begun working in UE5, so this may be the only time we show you footage from UE4. The next time we show the game should be in UE5, so please look forward to it.
-- Is the room where Sora wakes up also in Shibuya?
Nomura: That is located in Minami-Aoyama. However, the location of the main unit is different from what you see from the balcony, so the Osaka staff will come by later on to do some location scouting to make adjustments.
-- Melody of Memory featured a woman who was familiar with Quadratum. She was only voiced and not shown, but will she appear in KHIV?
Nomura: That is still a secret. As I said at the event, there was a time when I wasn't sure whether I would choose KHIV or VERUM REX as my next project. However, she is a central VERUM REX character.
-- I see.
Nomura: There seems to be a lot of anticipation for VERUM REX overseas (bitter smile). When Yozora was first introduced in KHIII, I got the impression that his reception was less than welcoming, but I guess that was not the case.
-- The logo has been redesigned.
Nomura: With the start of a new story, we took the opportunity to simplify the font. However, we wanted to retain that "KH" feel in spite of the new simplicity, so it took a lot of trial and error to reach a design that struck the right balance.
-- One year has passed since KHIII, so Sora's character design in KHIV is slightly more mature. His hair is silky and realistic, and even the impression he gives off has changed.
Nomura: Even when we were working on KHIII, there were discussions within the team about how realistic we should make the characters. We certainly could have made the hair silky smooth in KHIII if we wanted to. This time, since we are starting anew with the Lost Master Arc, we decided to make some drastic changes. The [characters'] appearances also match the nature of the world [they're in].
-- I hope we will meet Sora again, looking as he did in KHIII. Has this new costume design been finalized?
Nomura: No, not yet. There may still be some finer changes, such as with the details. As for the silhouette, I think it'll be similar to the one in this trailer.
-- The Master of Masters and his six disciples, the "Lost Masters," disappeared after the Keyblade War in Unchained χ. What happened to them?
Nomura: Even though we didn't show exactly what happened, we do know that five of the Foretellers, with the exception being Luxu, vanished after the Keyblade War.
-- So, they disappeared. But in KHIII's epilogue, Luxu "summons" his fellow disciples back and they are reunited. Are the Lost Masters a threat to Sora and his friends?
Nomura: Simply put, the Lost Masters are an opposing force like Organization XIII. However, not all of them have the same intentions. Their motives will be newly depicted in KHIV, so in that sense, I hope you will enjoy this new arc from the very beginning.
-- Who are the two wearing black coats in the trailer? One of them seems to be the Master of Masters...
Nomura: That's still a secret (laughs). By the way, in addition to Oka (Masaru Oka) who has worked with me on scenarios for the KH series up until now, I've asked Ishibashi (Akiko Ishibashi), a newcomer to the KH series, to join us in writing the scenario for KHIV. This marks the start of our 3-person team.
-- Why did you ask Ishibashi [to join you]?
Nomura: The biggest reason is because of how she factors into approaching new users, from the perspective of someone who has no experience with the KH series. She did a great job of integrating the characters' values and principles in NEO: The World Ends With You and other works, and I thought her way of thinking would be well-suited for KH.
-- About the EX gauge in the lower right...?
Nomura: Please wait for more information on that.
-- Changing the subject, what did you request for the new songs used in the trailer?
Nomura: I requested a sense of anticipation building towards the latter half, so you'd feel like you're waiting for a hero to appear. It was very difficult since I had to ask for adjustments to be made to the length of the song to match that of the video at the last minute. For Missing-Link's song, I wanted it to have vocals throughout, so the chorus was included in this trailer.
-- What are the "societies that sprawl and branch like veins" mentioned in the trailer?
Nomura: KH Missing Link takes place about 4 generations after Ephemer's time. His descendents have each formed their own societies: the main family who carries his bloodline is the "Society of Successors", while the branch family who doesn't is the "Society of Non-Successors".
Just like KHIV, we're considering how to approach new users and have asked Fukazawa (Ruiko Fukazawa), another newcomer to the series, to write the scenario.
-- The Keyblade seems to be strengthened by setting "pieces," which are shaped like figurines. That's pretty unique.
Nomura: We wanted them to look rich, so we made them in the form of figurines. The pieces can be obtained not just from the gacha, but also in the field. For example, you might get a message that says "___ pieces are currently available at ___ in Shibuya."
-- I spotted some pieces in the trailer that resembled Terra, among other characters. Terra is a character who hails from a time period long after Missing-Link, so are the pieces just created for the purposes of the game?
Nomura: The purpose of this association [between characters and pieces] is to collect records of all the worlds' pasts, presents, and futures. Each piece provides information on its character from all eras, and you'll be able to draw upon their abilities to fight.
-- I see. The battles look like the action in KHIII.
Nomura: The project started in parallel with KH Union Cross. We knew that if we were going to make the next mobile iteration of KH, we had to make sure it'd play similarly to the mainline games in order to satisfy the audience. Therefore, it was inevitable that we'd aim to create an experience that'd be close to the action you'd find in those titles.
-- Collecting figurine-like pieces sounds interesting, and the multiplayer action battles look quite fun.
Nomura: We're trying to create sharp things that we might not be able to accomplish in the mainline games. Please look forward to the closed beta test scheduled for this fall.
-- You mentioned that you added additional scenarios to KH Dark Road, more than what was originally planned.
Nomura: Initially we were planning to include the [other] classmates, as well as delve further into Xehanort's companions. However, due to a change of plans, I asked Kanemaki (Tomoco Kanemaki), who also worked on KH 358/2 Days and writes the series' light novel adaptations, to put together a scenario with a limited number of stories. The plan received further changes after that, and I had the team's scenario writers make adjustments to focus solely on Xehanort. However, I felt that we were losing too much by making all of these cuts, so I decided to add them back in at the end. As I said at the event, you'll even learn why Master Xehanort became bald (laughs).
-- Oh (laughs). I'm looking forward to it. Lastly, what plans do you have for the remaining duration of KH's 20th anniversary?
Nomura: KH Dark Road is nearing completion, and the two women who are working on the event scenes are giving their all, so please give them your support. It'll just be a little bit longer. KH Missing Link is scheduled for a closed beta test this fall. KHIV's development is being prioritized, and we don't have plans to release additional info for a while.
I'm hoping to put some other stuff together, so please wait for more information from official announcements.
COMMENTS
Nomura: Initially we were planning to include the classmates, as well as delve further into Xehanort's companions. However, due to a change of plans, I asked Kanemaki (Tomoco Kanemaki), who also worked on KH 358/2 Days and writes the series' light novel adaptations, to put together a scenario with a limited number of stories. The plan received further changes after that, and I had the team's scenario writers make adjustments to focus solely on Xehanort. However, I felt that we were losing too much by making all of these cuts, so I decided to add them back in at the end. As I said at the event, you'll even learn why Master Xehanort became bald (laughs).
Jeez Nomura, on one hand constantly cutting stuff that delves deeper into characters other than a single one is exactly what's one of my main pet peeves about the KH series, yet on the other I see here this time you apparently reconsidered and added these bits back in.
We'll see how this unfolds when the DR story finally releases and I'll remain skeptical until then, having feared from the beginning that the DR cast beyond Xehanort and partly Eraqus will remain flat window dressing characters.
Also wtf, the whole issue with Master Xehanort being bald I always attributed to his advanced age in that form, nothing special. This is similar to the whole Mickey's shirt stuff in 0.2, lol.
More focus on the characters in general and their interactions beyond lore dumps, light, darkness and heart speeches would do the series' quality more favor than side-steps such as Xehanort's hair loss or Mickey's shirt in the RoD.
If this goes on further we'll get extra information in the future about where Terra got his weird pants from, why Ventus was shirtless in the prologue of BBS and how Axel got those tear tattoos?
I wouldn't be surprised if Xehanort was descended from the Ephemer's bloodline the Society of Successors. Also kind of amused that Nomura was shocked at how popular was at Yozora becoming popular overseas lol
Do we REALLY need lore explanation on why Xehanort went bald? I can't say I'm surprised about Yozora's reception overseas, he brings a lot of new blood and intrigue to the series.
Also I'm slightly confused, when he says costume design isn't finalized yet. Does he mean Sora's costume design isn't complete or that his Quadratum design IS his new main design and he hasn't finalized the details yet.
Seriously? We need LORE to explain why an old man goes bald???
Nomura: Yes (laughs)
Do we REALLY need lore explanation on why Xehanort went bald? I can't say I'm surprised about Yozora's reception overseas, he brings a lot of new blood and intrigue to the series.
Also I'm slightly confused, when he says costume design isn't finalized yet. Does he mean Sora's costume design isn't complete or that his Quadratum design IS his new main design and he hasn't finalized the details yet.
Both? The outfit we see him wearing in the trailer is his new design for KH4, but it hasn't been finalized yet so we might see some minor changes at the next showing.
Everything I read about Missing Link and Dark Road is very interesting.
I think Missing Link is going to be a big surprise. It looks like the gatcha elements will be optional as you can get figures on the map, which by the way you can play it without leaving home and even go to other parts of the world using points to teleport.
I think it would be stupid of them not to release the game on consoles/PC. The gameplay is like 3, it has multiplayer and the scenes are dubbed, so many more people will want to play it, and if they see the interest of the people and that launching it outside of mobile is going to give them more money, they will end up doing it.
Well I'm slightly dissapointed, its not a bad design but idk Sora is missing some of the flair his previous designs had. It works for the realistic setting but it just looks plain compared to his other incarnations.
Seriously? We need LORE to explain why an old man goes bald???
Do we REALLY need lore explanation on why Xehanort went bald?
It's not the first time. Just remember we got a cutscene in 0.2 about Mickey losing his shirt to explain why he was shirtless when he appeared in the KH1 ending...
Forgot about the parting message so I went and edited it in.
-- Oh (laughs). I'm looking forward to it. Lastly, what plans do you have for the remaining duration of KH's 20th anniversary? Nomura: KH Dark Road is nearing completion, and the two women who are working on the event scenes are giving their all, so please give them your support. It'll just be a little bit longer. KH Missing Link is scheduled for a closed beta test this fall. KHIV's development is being prioritized, and we don't have plans to release additional info for a while. I'm hoping to put some other stuff together, so please wait for more information from official announcements. |
The fact that the three games have female writers makes me hope that the female characters are written better.
Plot twist: the lore behind Xehanort's hair IS "he got old." He just doesn't trust the players to figure that one themselves
The fact that the three games have female writers makes me hope that the female characters are written better.
Agreed. That’s all I’m begging for
She did a great job of integrating the characters' values and principles in NEO: The World Ends With You and other works, and I thought her way of thinking would be well-suited for KH
I'VE GIVEN FOR SO LONG AND FINALLY I GET TO RECIEVE
Nomura: There seems to be a lot of anticipation for VERUM REX overseas (bitter smile). When Yozora was first introduced in KHIII, I got the impression that his reception was less than welcoming, but I guess that was not the case |
Who's giving wrong information to Nomura?! Because I never got the impression Yozora wasn't well received...
At least now he's aware fans want a Verum Rex game.
Akiko Ishibashi (NEO:TWEWY) is a great addition to the KH writing team. Not if only they got rid of Masaru Oka... A new co-director and cutscene director would be welcomed too...
They are already made clear it will take a while for more KH4 news. I expect them to go radio silence for more than one year and come back in 2024.
I’m just shocked about the fact that Nomura’s perception seems to be THAT far off the reality.
How could he ever thought of Yozora not being popular? I mean, the whole Secret Episode was setting him up as such an interesting and cool character. They are literally investing their resources on presenting a character the best way they could and Nomura doubts that Yozora is popular?
This makes me feel a bit anxious tbh I mean imagine if he feels like “The fans hate original worlds let’s reduce them like in KH3”
I’m just shocked about the fact that Nomura’s perception seems to be THAT far off the reality.
How could he ever thought of Yozora not being popular? I mean, the whole Secret Episode was setting him up as such an interesting and cool character. They are literally investing their resources on presenting a character the best way they could and Nomura doubts that Yozora is popular?
This makes me feel a bit anxious tbh I mean imagine if he feels like “The fans hate original worlds let’s reduce them like in KH3”
Either he's lurking in the wrong places on the internet or he's being fed inaccurate info. I'm not sure which is the lesser of two evils.
Seriously? We need LORE to explain why an old man goes bald???
Nomura on his way to explain why Darkness is really jealous of people having hair, and makes people who embrace it bald:
I mean, a lot of early Verum Rex impressions were "please just let Versus XIII GO, Nomura."
Yozora was mostly positively received. I hardly saw any backlash for him, especially after his ReMind battle. His boss battle alone scored him high on many people's tier list, despite not knowing much about him. Sometimes that's all it takes for a video game character.
And hey, this answers my question about the Lost Masters I asked in another thread, making it totally pointless now XD
Nomura: I'm hoping to put some other stuff together, so please wait for more information from official announcements.
Does this mean there are more projects to be announced? ?
Does this mean there are more projects to be announced? ?
Not necessarily projects, but stuff for the anniversary celebration. Hopefully it doesn't include more merch.
Not necessarily projects, but stuff for the anniversary celebration. Hopefully it doesn't include more merch.
Or if it is more merch, it is reasonably priced and easily accessible.
I like that the series is getting new writers added on, especially the writer for Heavensward. This seems like this arc will tackle more mature themes and elements.
Who's giving wrong information to Nomura?! Because I never got the impression Yozora wasn't well received...
At least now he's aware fans want a Verum Rex game.
Akiko Ishibashi (NEO:TWEWY) is a great addition to the KH writing team. Not if only they got rid of Masaru Oka... A new co-director and cutscene director would be welcomed too...
They are already made clear it will take a while for more KH4 news. I expect them to go radio silence for more than one year and come back in 2024.
He read my posts lol. In early 2019 I hated Yozora and the Versus XIII stuff Nomura was trying to turn KH into. Even during Re Mind I was yelling at the tv to hyuck off with what was being shown.
I’ve mellowed and come around on Yozora and whatnot but I do not want a whole game of that.
Either he's lurking in the wrong places on the internet or he's being fed inaccurate info. I'm not sure which is the lesser of two evils.
I think it's referring to how Yozora was received when the base game launched.
Which was, of course, "oh, it's just Noctis, Nomura's still mad about Versus XIII."
We had no indication that Yozora would be a major character in the world of KH until Re Mind came out, and of course everyone's tune changed.
The fact that the three games have female writers makes me hope that the female characters are written better.
This was an inevitable necessity. During the Xehanort saga, we just had Kairi, Larxene, Namine, Xion and Aqua as the central female characters. Now, we have Skuld, Strelitzia, Urd, Vor and Nameless Star.
Nomura can write a female character if they have a central role to the plot, but as soon as they become secondary characters, he jobs them so hard. Namine, Xion and Aqua were well developed characters in the games that centered around them but that wasn't able to translate to Kingdom Hearts III.
I think it's referring to how Yozora was received when the base game launched.
Which was, of course, "oh, it's just Noctis, Nomura's still mad about Versus XIII."
We had no indication that Yozora would be a major character in the world of KH until Re Mind came out, and of course everyone's tune changed.
I can understand that, but were there really so many people saying that to make him think it was the majority opinion? The number of people are even aware of his history with Versus are far outnumbered by those who just see a kick-ass CG scene with anime characters and robots.
Kingdom Hearts gets a lot of "reactions" from people who aren't actually fans of the game and like to dunk on it for memes when there's news. I kinda wonder if that effects the transfer of information. If you count those people, the "majority opinion" on KH is that it makes zero sense, has too many Nomura characters and should just be a normal Disney game, so...
Kingdom Hearts gets a lot of "reactions" from people who aren't actually fans of the game and like to dunk on it for memes when there's news. I kinda wonder if that effects the transfer of information. If you count those people, the "majority opinion" on KH is that it makes zero sense, has too many Nomura characters and should just be a normal Disney game, so...
You've just reminded me that Nomura spends a lot of time on Youtube ?
He read my posts lol. In early 2019 I hated Yozora and the Versus XIII stuff Nomura was trying to turn KH into. Even during Re Mind I was yelling at the tv to hyuck off with what was being shown.
I’ve mellowed and come around on Yozora and whatnot but I do not want a whole game of that.
Me and you both LOL
He read my posts lol. In early 2019 I hated Yozora and the Versus XIII stuff Nomura was trying to turn KH into. Even during Re Mind I was yelling at the tv to hyuck off with what was being shown.
I’ve mellowed and come around on Yozora and whatnot but I do not want a whole game of that.
I don't blame Nomura for trying to move as much of Final Fantasy Versus XIII into Kingdom Hearts especially when Final Fantasy XV is arguably a new game. That game was being worked on since 2006, I think it's fair that some of the games ideas should stick around in some fashion.
KH Missing Link takes place about 4 generations after Ephemer's time.
So, I was originally right about Brain having time travelled only a short interval, but then changed my opinion. I did that because the grandfather thing seemed to have more weight than the secret report wording where Luxu says that he gave his keyblade away during the events at the end of UX (and not after them). The question is, can both be true? Four generations is about 100 years, then another 50 or so to Eraqus and young Xehanort, and 85 from there to the end of KH3. That's not long enough, but could there be a break somewhere else? We do know that Eraqus did time travel, because otherwise he would be over 90 years old in BBS. So, maybe Xehanort did too, and there is a long gap just before the scene where he meets the MoM?
Argh!!! Nomura, why can't you just do things in an order that makes sense? :p
His descendents have each formed their own societies: the main family who carries his bloodline is the "Society of Successors", while the branch family is the "Society of Non-Successors".
I wonder how literally we should take the term bloodline here? I have really hard time believing that Ephemer would have children with anyone else but Skuld, and while she has the option to return to early Scala via time travel, the meaning of her name suggests that her place is in the future. Also, having a literal bloodline of keyblade wielders is by itself problematic, because the keyblade chooses its master, and it's unlikely that there would be worthy wielders in four generations of same family in a row.
Maybe it just means the group of people to whom Ephemer gave the important items (the Box, the Book, and Master's Defender), and the "bloodline" is a bad translation caused by misunderstanding?
I wonder how literally we should take the term bloodline here? I have really hard time believing that Ephemer would have children with anyone else but Skuld, and while she has the option to return to early Scala via time travel, the meaning of her name suggests that her place is in the future. Also, having a literal bloodline of keyblade wielders is by itself problematic, because the keyblade chooses its master, and it's unlikely that there would be worthy wielders in four generations of same family in a row.
The idea that blood relations may have an effect on Keyblade wielding isn't exactly new. Everyone's been mulling it over for the past three years, ever since KH3's secret report revealed that Eraqus is descended from one of the first masters. It's something that Xehanort has a bit of an inferiority complex over.
| Maybe it just means the group of people to whom Ephemer gave the important items (the Box, the Book, and Master's Defender), and the "bloodline" is a bad translation caused by misunderstanding? |
I don't really see how the rest of the answer would make any sense if these people were all just random shmucks. The way they emphasize the setting in relation to Ephemer: how many years it's been since his death, his connection (or lack thereof) to the two societies... The word they use is 血筋 which can have non-familial nuances, but everything about this answer indicates that its in the context of blood relations.
I don't really see how the rest of the answer would make any sense if these people were all just random shmucks. The way they emphasize the setting in relation to Ephemer: how many years it's been since his death, his connection (or lack thereof) to the two societies... The word they use is 血筋 which can have non-familial nuances, but everything about this answer indicates that its in the context of blood relations.
But isn't stuff like that stereotypical for secret societies? They pretend to be a family?
Then again, maybe I'm simply overestimating the importance of meaningful names, and Skuld did return to this timeline with Ephemer. I guess I'm going to believe that for now.
Me reading this interview thinking about the awesome and solid world building in Kingdom Hearts 1 turn to this.
[SPOILER]God I need therapy[/SPOILER].
Me reading this interview thinking about the awesome and solid world building in Kingdom Hearts 1 turn to this.
[SPOILER]God I need therapy[/SPOILER].
Some days I'm not even sure why I still care ;-;
I wonder how literally we should take the term bloodline here? I have really hard time believing that Ephemer would have children with anyone else but Skuld, and while she has the option to return to early Scala via time travel, the meaning of her name suggests that her place is in the future. Also, having a literal bloodline of keyblade wielders is by itself problematic, because the keyblade chooses its master, and it's unlikely that there would be worthy wielders in four generations of same family in a row.
Maybe it just means the group of people to whom Ephemer gave the important items (the Box, the Book, and Master's Defender), and the "bloodline" is a bad translation caused by misunderstanding?
Maybe Skuld goes through the same process that Brain does in that two versions of her coexist? A version of Skuld that ends up having a relationship with Ephemer during the Missing Link era and another version of Skuld that gets materialised once someone remembered them during the Birth by Sleep era?
I can understand that, but were there really so many people saying that to make him think it was the majority opinion? The number of people are even aware of his history with Versus are far outnumbered by those who just see a kick-ass CG scene with anime characters and robots.
I honestly wonder what version of Versus these people see in their heads when they look at Verum Rex and KH4.
I wonder if the reason Xehanort ends up bald is similar to Voldermort doing so in the Harry Potter series, with his actions making him lose his soul (multiple times over, in fact). There's also a bit more to it than that, like the snake connection, but obviously Nomura wouldn't do something like that. And man, is this weird to talk about. O_o
About Skuld... while I don't doubt that Ephemer sadly moved on without her and she's of course Subject X, I will say that the woman who's Xehanort's mother looked an astounding amount like Skuld. So who knows? Maybe Skuld could somehow not be Subject X, or there could be two Skulds running around somehow. -shrugs- I also know Xehanort's mother is a while after Ephemer founded Scala, so I'm not saying that she might be Skuld or a Skuld, but maybe one of Skuld's descendents, if she was somehow still around with Ephemer, after all.
Anyway, a lot of this is good and interesting news, like with the new scenario writers, and I'm excited. I loved Neo TWEWY's scenario writer so much--and this should just work well, with someone who worked with moderninzing Shibuya before writing modernizing "Shibuya" again. And hopefully this will mean great things for our female characters, like people have already pointed out, as Nagi and Shoka in particular were great.
I should also probably say that I was one who didn't like Yozora, because I was nervous that the Verum Rex stuff might take over KH, and I didn't like Yozora for crystallizing Sora in the bad ending, etc. but I'm willing to try with him now.
But isn't stuff like that stereotypical for secret societies? They pretend to be a family?
Then again, maybe I'm simply overestimating the importance of meaningful names, and Skuld did return to this timeline with Ephemer. I guess I'm going to believe that for now.
Alternatively you can join us Ephemer x Player shippers in the ship graveyard 8D
I wonder if the reason Xehanort ends up bald is similar to Voldermort doing so in the Harry Potter series, with his actions making him lose his soul (multiple times over, in fact). There's also a bit more to it than that, like the snake connection, but obviously Nomura wouldn't do something like that. And man, is this weird to talk about. o_O
Actually, now that you mention it, the kh4 trailer did mention the soul in one of the quotes showing up on screen.
Maybe this next saga will explore the concept of soul in a similar way that the heart has been used for the dark seeker saga.
Edit: thinking about it, I can even see it as something they could use to retroactively explain how some Nobodies remained looking human and also the nature of the Lingering Will left behind by Terra
Okay, I have a question, because I have seen this on other websites, but it does appear to be just nowhere in the article: Does it say somewhere that Missing Link and/or Dark Road will explore the mysteries of Xehanort's bloodline?
Because it seems like someone conflated Xehanort and Eraqus in that regard, but I just wanted to make sure.
Okay, I have a question, because I have seen this on other websites, but it does appear to be just nowhere in the article: Does it say somewhere that Missing Link and/or Dark Road will explore the mysteries of Xehanort's bloodline?
Because it seems like someone conflated Xehanort and Eraqus in that regard, but I just wanted to make sure.
It does not. I don't think they've ever brought up the subject of Xehanort's lineage. It's only ever been about Eraqus, and I guess Ephemer now.
But it would make a lot of sense for Xehanort to be from Ephemer's bloodline, especially if Eraqus is from Brain's, wouldn't it?
In fact, I'm starting to see some connections that could form a story. It's a dark Scala, because the ruling family (which would be Ephemer's) is having a darkness problem, or perhaps even Darkness with a capital D. Brain's job is to get rid of that problem, that's why the ark landed him there. When he succeeds, the city transforms into light version (think Hollow Bastion vs. Radiant Garden). Also, taking Babynort away could be part of that cleansing.
It is very speculative, but would explain a lot.
It's interesting to think that Xehanort potentially being from Ephemer's bloodline as in the founder of Scala still gives him an inferiority complex over Eraqus being descended from Brain. Maybe he's from the "hidden" bloodline.
It's interesting to think that Xehanort potentially being from Ephemer's bloodline as in the founder of Scala still gives him an inferiority complex over Eraqus being descended from Brain. Maybe he's from the "hidden" bloodline.
He simply doesn't know about his true origins.
But it would make a lot of sense for Xehanort to be from Ephemer's bloodline, especially if Eraqus is from Brain's, wouldn't it?
In fact, I'm starting to see some connections that could form a story. It's a dark Scala, because the ruling family (which would be Ephemer's) is having a darkness problem, or perhaps even Darkness with a capital D. Brain's job is to get rid of that problem, that's why the ark landed him there. When he succeeds, the city transforms into light version (think Hollow Bastion vs. Radiant Garden). Also, taking Babynort away could be part of that cleansing.
It is very speculative, but would explain a lot.
I prefer this.
He simply doesn't know about his true origins.
Doesn't he? Would be kind of weird to give Xehanort this whole convoluted backstory and he died without ever learning it.
Doesn't he? Would be kind of weird to give Xehanort this whole convoluted backstory and he died without ever learning it.
I don't see a problem if that's the case.
But it's not impossible he does learn about his origins (maybe about Player too). There is that line when he's talking to the Master, "I've learned... the reason for my existence" which in JP is「悪い意味で自分の存在意義を感じた」(I felt the reason for my existence in a bad meaning ("in a bad way" may be more natural)). If, for example, infant Xehanort's removal from Scala correlates with its transformation, or even abandonment, it certainly fits.
The Secret Report where he mentions Eraqus's lineage is written early on in his tour of the worlds before his Mark of Mastery, when he's still in his youth. There's plenty of time after that point for him to learn about himself.
Doesn't he? Would be kind of weird to give Xehanort this whole convoluted backstory and he died without ever learning it.
He seems to have learned about it soon after writing the KH3 secret report where he mentions Eraqus being blueblood. From BBS Xehanort's report VIII, note the term Successor:
"I had already shown the Mark and become a Keyblade Master—but having been passed over as Successor, all that remained to me was the road of teacher."
Re: the comment that ML takes place 4 generations after Ephemer, I’m seeing a lot of people making the assumption that this means ML takes place 4 generations after UX, and that KH3 is therefore set ~180-ish years after UX. But that’s overlooking the fact that we don’t actually know how much time passes from the end of UX to when Ephemer emerges from the lifeboat. All the other Union leaders + company got pulled across time, so for all we know Ephemer skipped forward several hundred years. Am I missing something?
I’m seeing a lot of people making the assumption that this means ML takes place 4 generations after UX, and that KH3 is therefore set ~180-ish years after UX.
You need to add the time between the beginning of Missing Link and the beginning of Dark Road, which is presumably two generations, or about 50 years. So, the total would be somewhere between 200 and 250 years, which is still way shorter than what Luxu tells in the secret reports.
All the other Union leaders + company got pulled across time, so for all we know Ephemer skipped forward several hundred years. Am I missing something?
First, that would not matter, because there wouldn't be anybody for the Eye to see, or to be passed on during those centuries. Second, large amount of debris on the scene where he emerges should mean that the town was destroyed very recently. Third, it makes sense that the ark/lifeboat had exactly 7 destinations pre-programmed into it (one for each pod), but 8 people ended up using it, leaving the last one without a destination.
Well this certainly clears things up a bit. He is indeed talking about the worlds of the games themselves and not the characters.
Someone really oughta specify next time....or maybe not. Nomura prolly gettin very tired of this question
Well this certainly clears things up a bit. He is indeed talking about the worlds of the games themselves and not the characters.
Someone really oughta specify next time....or maybe not. Nomura prolly gettin very tired of this question
Yeah, we knew this already, it was in the web interview, hence why I left it out here.
My take is that he misunderstood the sentiments he's seeing online and thought he was getting ahead of things by addressing it early, when he's really just failing to realize that people only want cameos.
I've wanted TWEWY cameos since DDD, Neku and Sora need that reunion dang it. But I feel like Nomura is gonna keep saying his Shibuya is different until his face turns blue, poor guy needs to breathe.
Except when he says they're the same sometimes.
In-between saying that everything he's doing now is not related to Versus XIII.
I think the exact relationship between different works by the same people is much more ethereal and formless than people who want a yes/no answer for the wiki can grasp. And I think a lot of creators resort to hard "no"s because it's the easiest way to explain it in a way where your brand manager won't get mad at you.
Just because he says they won't show up in Quadratum or there's no connection - normal Shibuya could still be in KH4 in some shape or form. Maybe Sora & Co. need to return to Quadratum some point in the story but can't find Nameless Star in the Final World so they find Shibuya and that let's them get to Quadratum.
TWEWY Shibuya is also not "normal", since in the Ultimania Nomura differentiates them from Shibuya (ours) instead of eachother. Instead, both would seem to be "Shibuyas of death".
There's a lot that's up in the air but even within "the Quadratum connected to Yozora" there might be multiple Shibuyas. There's a whole lot of scenes in which their context in reality is still not clear, like the contents of the Verum Rex advertisement.
Even though this isn't "a TWEWY crossover", which is clear, I still think pretty much anything could happen in the game regardless of what Nomura says. We don't even know what Quadratum or Yozora or any of these things actually are, after all.
I bet we get a Star Wars: Rise of the Skywalker twist and it's revealed that Kairi is Master Xehanort's grand daughter. That would explain Kairi's grandmother knowing the story about the keyblade war - because she got it from Xehanort.
I bet we get a Star Wars: Rise of the Skywalker twist and it's revealed that Kairi is Master Xehanort's grand daughter. That would explain Kairi's grandmother knowing the story about the keyblade war - because she got it from Xehanort.
Why would that require MX being her grandpa
Someone was talking about ephemer traveling to the future but I don't think that is true because every time they do it the ark disappear but with ephemer it was still there Wich mean he didn't go anywhere
Twewy's Shibuya is written in kanji like the real Shibuya. Quadratum's is written in katakana.
Why would that require MX being her grandpa
I'm just saying we'll probably get something crazy for Master Xehanort. The way that Nomura is talking about how he wants to explain even why Xehanort is bald, why not throw in something like "Xehanort is Kairi's grand father"? (not that I want that)
I bet we get a Star Wars: Rise of the Skywalker twist and it's revealed that Kairi is Master Xehanort's grand daughter. That would explain Kairi's grandmother knowing the story about the keyblade war - because she got it from Xehanort.
That'd be horrible because Xehanort basically killed his own granddaughter
Twewy's Shibuya is written in kanji like the real Shibuya. Quadratum's is written in katakana.
This is not true, at least not within Kingdom Hearts. I don't know why people keep saying this.
In the Ultimania interview, Nomura spells this out quite explicitly, and time and time again people recount it as if they are from a different universe than me where they are seeing an interview that says the opposite.
Both Shibuyas mentioned in KH so far (if they are actually different) are written in katakana. Regardless of anything else, the spelling thing links them closer together, not farther apart.
After watching some of NEO TWEWY, the writing is pretty solid, I didn't realize the writer also worked on FFXV too. It will be interesting what she brings to the table, especially where she has experience with death themes. I honestly feel like this arc will be split between the two realms. The main numbered titles will focus on Sora and Quadtraum and the "side games" will focus on the characters in the realm of light with Sora in some form occasionally crossing over (except for a Verum Rex side game.) I could be wrong too but this writer can handle multiple characters.
I was wondering.. with Nomura saying they were deciding between Verum Rex and KH4 as the next mainline entry, does this mean KH4 won’t contain that much Yozora content? I was really hoping for the Quadratum game to be the game discussing Yozora and his Story
He read my posts lol. In early 2019 I hated Yozora and the Versus XIII stuff Nomura was trying to turn KH into. Even during Re Mind I was yelling at the tv to hyuck off with what was being shown.
I’ve mellowed and come around on Yozora and whatnot but I do not want a whole game of that.
I'm apathetic towards Yozora and his merry crew. That's unlikely to change in the near future.
That'd be horrible because Xehanort basically killed his own granddaughter
As if that's the worst thing Xehanort has done...
I was wondering.. with Nomura saying they were deciding between Verum Rex and KH4 as the next mainline entry, does this mean KH4 won’t contain that much Yozora content? I was really hoping for the Quadratum game to be the game discussing Yozora and his Story
The Lost Masters Arc is an ongoing narrative thread that likely spans more than one game, the Yozora game can still co-exist after Kingdom Hearts IV.
The Lost Masters Arc is an ongoing narrative thread that likely spans more than one game, the Yozora game can still co-exist after Kingdom Hearts IV.
Verum Rex will probably be the 358/2 Days of this arc.
Yozora will probably be in KH4 but most of his backstory won't be explained until Verum Rex
Happy to hear their adding another scenario writer to the team. The writing in NEO:TWEWY was pretty enjoyable for me so I hope she can pick up the slack of the more recent games. Though there's no saying how much influence she'll have in the end.
I'm still not sure how to feel about the whole Missing-Link game, but I guess I'll just have to wait and see. I feel like the perspective we've gotten of everything has changed a lot in the years since UX first launched. I still don't know how to feel over DR's revelation that most worlds have just come back to being recently and don't really have centuries of history of existing separately. With the new revelation that ML takes place 4 Generations after Ephimire's rebuilding of the keyblade society makes me wonder how far in the past UX really was. Everything feels less spread-out then I personally would have wanted.
thinking about time passed the gods of olympus were probably alredy alive before the worlds were separeted and maybe king triton and that is why he had a problem with the keyblade
Twewy's Shibuya is written in kanji like the real Shibuya. Quadratum's is written in katakana.
TWEWY’s Shibuya uses both, though. RG Shibuya is in kanji and Shibuya in katakana is meant to denote the UG. シブヤ is supposed to denote that it is the world of the dead/a different Shibuya from the regular one for all of these series. Back in the day it was misunderstood to be believed he was speaking of the TWEWY Shibuya but in fact it is just Nomura’s way of saying that the Shibuya we see is a different one from the real world one where people are alive.
Sometimes i wonder if verum rex is actually gonna be part of the franchise, or entirely different thing, that will just have kingdom hearts crossover, the same way FF characters show up in KH.
Sometimes i wonder if verum rex is actually gonna be part of the franchise, or entirely different thing, that will just have kingdom hearts crossover, the same way FF characters show up in KH.
I believe Nomura is devious enough to pitch and greenlight his own new IP by hiding it in an existing one
I still don't know how to feel over DR's revelation that most worlds have just come back to being recently and don't really have centuries of history of existing separately. With the new revelation that ML takes place 4 Generations after Ephimire's rebuilding of the keyblade society makes me wonder how far in the past UX really was. Everything feels less spread-out then I personally would have wanted.
The drift here is both frustrating and interesting to me. Yeah, a lot of the premise of KH has been strongly called into question and not even through a shocking twist but just through somewhat confusing and casual revelations. But in a way, isn't the worlds not having real history closer to the truth? You can watch Aladdin in a DVD player over and over, and it will be the same every time; centuries worth of Agrabah history will never come into existence. A world is a story that plays out, and like a DVD, it can be replayed through memory (CoM), data (coded), prophetic illusion (X), or even its own dreams (DDD). But even if Sora's adventures in the world are slightly different, the base story he is modifying by interacting with it remains ultimately the same, and trends towards its same path.
You might call it the "world order".
The reason I kind of like this stuff is because I feel like it's implicit in KH from the beginning that this universe could never actually function as a bunch of planets in space sharing the same universe and rules. I feel inclined to list examples here but I'm sure everyone has already thought of numerous ones while playing the games. Yes, the illusion has been broken, but it was always an illusion, and now we are witnessing the falseness of reality itself.
The Lost Masters Arc is an ongoing narrative thread that likely spans more than one game, the Yozora game can still co-exist after Kingdom Hearts IV.
You mean like in 2030?:cry:
Yes, the illusion has been broken, but it was always an illusion, and now we are witnessing the falseness of reality itself.
I think that's what I am struggling with. Because like you said you always had to stretch your suspension of believe pretty far with how the worlds are presented and the more current entries kind of start poking holes in that suspension. It works well with the meta narrative, but really makes me wonder about the in world logic.
I believe Nomura is devious enough to pitch and greenlight his own new IP by hiding it in an existing one
I don't blame him, the executives at Square Enix are likelier to greenlight Nomura's new idea if it's branded under Kingdom Hearts because that's a proven commodity.
I don't blame him, the executives at Square Enix are likelier to greenlight Nomura's new idea if it's branded under Kingdom Hearts because that's a proven commodity.
But wouldn't that just make it owned by Disney if its under the KH IP? Is Yozora considered a Disney Character like Sora is?
I honestly wonder what version of Versus these people see in their heads when they look at Verum Rex and KH4.
For me it's the version from TGS 2006. Where Noctis was slicing hittas up left and right with armiger. Obviously KH will never be that violent (thanks Disney!) But I'll be damned if *now* isn't the time to finally make that vision a reality. UE5 is gorgeous when used properly and apparently it is easy enough to develop with if one is familiar to UE4 (i dont know anything about gamedev). So...make it happen.
VR shouldve been the next game imo, just knowing how poorly and *in media res* this series loves to be, i think a VR game explaining Yozora and co + the world of Quadratum from the ground up THE. Segueing to kh4 wouldve been the play
But wouldn't that just make it owned by Disney if its under the KH IP? Is Yozora considered a Disney Character like Sora is?
Yes and yes. Probably a good thing in Nomura's eyes, means that no one at SE can fuck with it like they did XV.
Nomura's position in relation to SE and Disney is like a puppet king who knows he is a puppet and plays the two factions using him against eachother, keeping a low profile to accomplish his real goals.
Yes and yes. Probably a good thing in Nomura's eyes, means that no one at SE can fuck with it like they did XV.
But Disney might make Nomura add Disney worlds to Verum Rex somehow
But Disney might make Nomura add Disney worlds to Verum Rex somehow
And?
And?
The question would be how much content would Disney want to be in the game over original content
Will Nomura be able to tell his story in full? I hope so
But Disney might make Nomura add Disney worlds to Verum Rex somehow
That's great! Disney is the best part of KH :) (the oc is Disney also)
I mean, a lot of early Verum Rex impressions were "please just let Versus XIII GO, Nomura."
Meanwhile, mine was: "GO FOR IT YA FOKIN MADLAD"
That's great! Disney is the best part of KH :)
I love the Disney part but I'm worried about the pacing of Verum Rex. Imagine if you play as Yozora in the Muppets world and then you get a 10 minute cutscene explaining some of Yozora's backstory after finishing that world and then he goes to the next world. (and that happens for the whole game)
Then the end of the game is where most of the original plot takes place
I doubt it will happen again but I did not like that in KH3 (even though there was lots of foreshadowing for the end of the game - some of the Disney Worlds felt a little like filler, can't deny that)
But Disney might make Nomura add Disney worlds to Verum Rex somehow
Oh I hadn't thought of that, but yeah, if Verum Rex is sold as a KH Spin-Off Disney might ask for KH worlds to feature in it, which might not really jive with the original plot and atmosphere.
Though I could also see them being cool with owning a new FF-eque property and just be like "okay this one is an exception".
My first impression of Verum Rex was: Clever man that Nomura.
Also the idea of a muppet Yozora is hilarious and now I want a muppet world.
Who the hell doesn't want DISNEY worlds in Quadratum? There's no way in hell we will only explore Shibuya for the entire game.
Who the hell doesn't want DISNEY worlds in Quadratum? There's no way in hell we will only explore Shibuya for the entire game.
I want to access them like Disney's Extreme Skate Adventure
[ATTACH type="full" width="615px"]15203[/ATTACH]
I want to access them like Disney's Extreme Skate Adventure
[ATTACH type="full" width="615px" alt="1651620655952.png"]15203[/ATTACH]
Oh that's cool. Maybe Sora goes to a movie theater and he enters the posters of the films. That would allow Quadratum to be its own world and then just one nexus location where Sora can access all the other worlds.
The only problem is incorporating the Gummi Ship into that.
Oh that's cool. Maybe Sora goes to a movie theater and he enters the posters of the films. That would allow Quadratum to be its own world and then just one nexus location where Sora can access all the other worlds.
The only problem is incorporating the Gummi Ship into that.
Maybe they bring back the Dives from 3D? Can't think of any way the Gummi could get there unless that one section in UX where Dolan and Gooby show up in Daybreak was post KH3 and they were trying to use it to cross realms.
But Disney might make Nomura add Disney worlds to Verum Rex somehow
I don't think Disney actually pays this much attention.
Disney got picky with some KH3 stuff, because it was an extremely expensive and high-profile game known to the mainstream and used a bunch of more recent brands that Disney considers Very Important. But for the most part they just let Nomura do whatever he wants with his own stuff, which is just one product of thousands they're releasing at a time. Do you think they had to approve the content of X Back Cover?
I believe Nomura is devious enough to pitch and greenlight his own new IP by hiding it in an existing one
What a king if he actually manage to do it lmao.
I don't think Disney actually pays this much attention.
Disney got picky with some KH3 stuff, because it was an extremely expensive and high-profile game known to the mainstream and used a bunch of more recent brands that Disney considers Very Important. But for the most part they just let Nomura do whatever he wants with his own stuff, which is just one product of thousands they're releasing at a time. Do you think they had to approve the content of X Back Cover?
They probably reviewed Back Cover to make sure that it was "on brand" for DISNEY, but nothing else really.
Oh that's cool. Maybe Sora goes to a movie theater and he enters the posters of the films. That would allow Quadratum to be its own world and then just one nexus location where Sora can access all the other worlds.
The only problem is incorporating the Gummi Ship into that.
Time to retire it. With PS5 they can do near-instant world hopping like with the dimensions in the newest Ratchet and Clank.
But wouldn't that just make it owned by Disney if its under the KH IP? Is Yozora considered a Disney Character like Sora is?
Yes, it would. I don't think Nomura cares about the legal technicality of ownership because he still has the executive decision making power for Kingdom Hearts from a creative standpoint.
Time to retire it. With PS5 they can do near-instant world hopping like with the dimensions in the newest Ratchet and Clank.
No way! They should NOT retire the Gummi Ship. KH3 showed how much fun it can be and the potential there is to further develop it. The Gummi Ship isn't about actually travelling to other worlds because they could easily do that a la CoM where you walk up to a door and go in. The Gummi Ship is another gameplay feature to add to the game. It would be lame if Sora just hopped directly to another world. It would actually feel less like "another world" and just another level you warped to. I know that's essentially what the Gummi Ship/world map does anyway, but the feeling of going through all of that adds to the experience that you're really going to another world.
Gummispace (or lanes between, or whatever you want to call it) is a KH universe thing, and KH4 doesn't take place in KH universe, but Quadratum one. Therefore, it seems obvious that KH4 will not have any gummispace in it. It also seems almost equally obvious that it will return in future games, once Sora is back home.
That is assuming KH4 doesn't take place at least partially in the KH-verse and not just exclusively in Unreality.
Maybe we could get a hybrid between Gummi Traveling and normal gameplay
Sora, Donald and Goofy could get Gummisuits (basically Keyblade Armor) created by Chip & Dale and fly through space and fight normally. In Gummisuits you would get a Gummisuit exclusive Form Change where you shoot lasers
I'm imagining Donald & Goofy with basically Keyblade Armor and it sounds sick
Time to retire it. With PS5 they can do near-instant world hopping like with the dimensions in the newest Ratchet and Clank.
The Gummi Ship was never there to hide a loading screen, so that's not really a reason to remove it.
We have plenty of KH games already that don't use Gummi Ships or any sort of travel minigame, it's clearly something they keep bringing back because they want that part of the game in there.
I reiterate it would be cool to fly a Gigas from place to place...
Remember those?? The things that nominally exist in Quadratum?
Gummispace (or lanes between, or whatever you want to call it) is a KH universe thing, and KH4 doesn't take place in KH universe, but Quadratum one. Therefore, it seems obvious that KH4 will not have any gummispace in it. It also seems almost equally obvious that it will return in future games, once Sora is back home.
Why is everyone talking like it's a fact that KH4 will take place in only Quadratum? We don't know much of ANYTHING about the game.
That's like watching the first KH3 trailer and thinking the whole game will take place in Twilight Town.
We don't know for sure, but Nomura did say that the Endor forest place is part of Quadratum. If that really is a "Star Wars world" or this game's equivalent of such a thing, then it would seem that at least some of the "worlds" in this game will be in Quadratum and thus it wouldn't just be a 2-hour prologue.
Unless it isn't actually Endor.
I would agree that we don't really know anything yet!
We don't know for sure, but Nomura did say that the Endor forest place is part of Quadratum. If that really is a "Star Wars world" or this game's equivalent of such a thing, then it would seem that at least some of the "worlds" in this game will be in Quadratum and thus it wouldn't just be a 2-hour prologue.
Unless it isn't actually Endor.
I would agree that we don't really know anything yet!
Honestly, I have this strong feeling that it's just elements of Star Wars used in Quadratum and not actually a full Star Wars "world". Which I think might be an interesting approach for KH. We're used to a "world" with all those DISNEY elements contained within that world - that ultimately causes this huge separation and no actual "crossover". Imagine if Quadratum had elements of Star Wars, Alice in Wonderland (live action), and The Jungle Book (live action) all actually interacting somehow.
Not only that, but it would be an approach using the DISNEY properties for storytelling versus being an obligatory full-scale world. I definitely do NOT want to get rid of full-blown DISNEY worlds (especially traditionally animated ones), but I just can't help feeling like Nomura is revisiting KH's core concept of "crossover" which was basically abandoned by KH2. Also, if Nomura only pulled what he needed from each DISNEY property, he could focus on telling HIS story instead of having to do what DISNEY needed him to fulfill (like Arendelle in KH3).
Why is everyone talking like it's a fact that KH4 will take place in only Quadratum? We don't know much of ANYTHING about the game.
That's like watching the first KH3 trailer and thinking the whole game will take place in Twilight Town.
Honestly, there are people even on this site who have been running rampant with making blatant assumptions and treating them as fact, not just with KH4 but also ML. It's never happened before and I really don't get why it's starting now.
Honestly, there are people even on this site who have been running rampant with making blatant assumptions and treating them as fact, not just with KH4 but also ML. It's never happened before and I really don't get why it's starting now.
Well they can say whatever they want about Missing-Link because I don't care about that except for cutscenes.
I do wonder if this is an actual marketing strategy by Square Enix? I mean, it definitely did a good job making people think KH is going in a completely different (and "more mature") direction and is "starting fresh" - which might get some nay-sayers/haters to hop on it.
I think if Nomura explained the themes he's working with to Square Enix they would immediately tell him he's not allowed to do them
Well they can say whatever they want about Missing-Link because I don't care about that except for cutscenes.
I do wonder if this is an actual marketing strategy by Square Enix? I mean, it definitely did a good job making people think KH is going in a completely different (and "more mature") direction and is "starting fresh" - which might get some nay-sayers/haters to hop on it.
No one at SE said anything to encourage anyone to make these assumptions, so it's definitely not intentional.
I for one at least am pleased to hear about the prospect of finally having a more "mature" Sora. We've already had silly, doofus Sora for multiple games, time for some actual development for him. I don't want Sora to regress in maturity like Goku did in Dragon Ball Super.
It would also be interesting how other characters would react to this change in him.
The fandom made the same assumption about Sora in KH3 and look how that turned out.
Yeah in some ways he was worse than his KH2 self. Maybe it will be different this time...maybe. Us fans have always made the same assumptions like when people viewed Deep Dive and thought no more Disney worlds for KH2. History is repeating itself once more here.
Honestly, there are people even on this site who have been running rampant with making blatant assumptions and treating them as fact, not just with KH4 but also ML. It's never happened before and I really don't get why it's starting now.
I think collectively we've all just become stupider
No one at SE said anything to encourage anyone to make these assumptions, so it's definitely not intentional.
I mean that could be the strategy. If they understand how gamers will react to the teaser trailer, they show certain things to make fans think a certain thing. It's like when movie trailers only show you things from the first 30 minutes of a movie and mislead you on what it's all about. Showing only the Quadratum side and a five second DISNEY portion leads the audience to think things will be "more mature" ESPECIALLY when the reaction to the Yozora fight/end of KH3 already made people think that.
I don't get how people think it's "impossible" for Donald and Goofy to be in the more realistic Quadratum, when Nomura basically covered that in The Caribbean - which was obviously the test to see if it was even feasible to go forward with the Quadratum style.
I for one at least am pleased to hear about the prospect of finally having a more "mature" Sora. We've already had silly, doofus Sora for multiple games, time for some actual development for him. I don't want Sora to regress in maturity like Goku did in Dragon Ball Super.
It would also be interesting how other characters would react to this change in him.
Personally i feel like KH1 and CoM Sora was him at his smartest and most mature, since then he's kind of been sliding more into the dumb, kind hearted shonen protagnoist archetype.
Personally i feel like KH1 and CoM Sora was him at his smartest and most mature, since then he's kind of been sliding more into the dumb, kind hearted shonen protagnoist archetype.
My head canon is that Roxas/Xion took away some of Sora's maturity in KH2 and future games lol.
Personally i feel like KH1 and CoM Sora was him at his smartest and most mature, since then he's kind of been sliding more into the dumb, kind hearted shonen protagnoist archetype.
"CoM Sora = Smart and Mature"
He got pissed at Goofy and basically threw a tantrum cuz he got told to slow down and think ahead instead of rushing in like an idiot because "muh namine"
"CoM Sora = Smart and Mature"
He got pissed at Goofy and basically threw a tantrum cuz he got told to slow down and think ahead instead of rushing in like an idiot because "muh namine"
I think it's mistaken as "Sora being smart and mature" versus the reality that "CoM's writing was smart and mature".
It is ironic that Sora was at his most mature, level headed self in the very first game. As [USER=38586]@Face My Fears[/USER] said, Roxas and Xion must have taken some of that away from him.
CoM Sora believed a shady guy who lured him into a castle that literally stole all of his abilities when he was told he'd find Riku and Mickey there. Sure, Naminé was already messing with him, but that fact proves that it's really hard to tell what in CoM is actually Sora thinking out of his own free will and what isn't.
I personally don't mind Sora being kindhearted and kind of dumb honestly. People often mistake maturity for being serious and grounded, aka what Riku is. What Sora lacks in intellectual maturity he has displayed a keen sense of empathy and in KH3 he has a great sense of emotional depth when it comes to relating to others. The only "maturity" I can see happening is him slowing down a little and being a little calmer, but I don't see him going the Riku route.
What I don’t get is, what do you exactly refer to when saying KH3 Sora’s dumb?
I mean, he is very kindhearted and doing fun with Donald and Goofy but I wouldn’t consider him as stupid EXCEPT for the KG cutscene where he hugs Kairi instead of fighting Terranort
I actually thought KH3 Sora was him at his best. He went on a journey to reclaim his strength and had doubts about it along the way. He had a moment where he gets re-affirmed that he is strong enough (saving Aqua and Ven), which gives him a confidence boost, so he isn't moping around... but then the ultimate climactic battle/test of his strength - he fails. Which is why his scream at the Keyblade Graveyard hit me really hard because Sora is so used to charging in and things working out. But this time around, he isn't strong enough AND this time around everyone he loves is there with him and not just Donald and Goofy AND they actually die and not just "something something darkness". Which made his choice to break the natural law and time travel was really impactful.
"CoM Sora = Smart and Mature"
He got pissed at Goofy and basically threw a tantrum cuz he got told to slow down and think ahead instead of rushing in like an idiot because "muh namine"
Fair, but that was largely later on when his memories were more strongly manipulated. Plus Sora was more introspective and insightful in this game than he has seemed since. But yeah now that I've seen a few of his actions pointed out, smart and mature might not be the right words, he just seemed less Shonen Protagonist I guess.
What I don’t get is, what do you exactly refer to when saying KH3 Sora’s dumb?
I mean, he is very kindhearted and doing fun with Donald and Goofy but I wouldn’t consider him as stupid EXCEPT for the KG cutscene where he hugs Kairi instead of fighting Terranort
Hm... I would have to replay/watch the game to say concretely, but I just remember Sora kinda feeling a bit ditzy in KH3. Like I don't mind him being a bit of a goof, but sometime it felt a bit overdone. Plus it felt like a lot of the characters treated him like a dumb goof, which kind of strengthened the impression of him kinda being on the dumb side.
It honestly feels like there's another weird plot thing going on in KH3 with Sora's odder moments, rather than him being dumb, but the game ends without revealing such a thing, so...?
Tbh KH3 Sora is great, I love how animated and insecure he can be. The stupidest Sora has ever been is DDD imo.
For me, it will always be KH2. I wanted Leon and Mickey to bitchslap his ass at different points throughout that game, he was so stupid.
This might be a hot take but one of my favorite Soras has to be Data Sora. I know he's not really Sora, but I found this take a lot more compelling then most Soras. I like KH1 Sora too, but at times I didn't feel he had a strong enough voice in the middle of the arc, and just went along with things. He had strong moments in the beginning and end of KH1, but the middle he kind of just went with the program unless Riku showed up. But he's probably my favorite of the game Soras, maybe?
I grew to appreciate KH3 Sora more and more as time went on. CoM Sora is so all over the place with his memory wiped personality that it's not really Sora but a Namine injected one. DDD Sora is a step above KH2 Sora but still has that problem of just going along with things at times.
KH2 Sora is my least favorite. He begins the dumb shonen protagonist route that Sora still occasionally has today, but with the added layer of his hypocrisy it makes all his speeches about "hearts" when dealing with Disney characters and Organization members moot. What was even the point of giving him a Nobody if it didn't change his outlook on the concept by the end of the game? This is why my favorite Sora is from the manga, despite not being canon lol.
KH2 is Sora's worst and DDD his dumbest. DDD is why I live in fear of Sora not having Donald and Goofy with him in KH4. SDG divide the comedic relief between them, with Sora alone or Sora with Riku Sora has to he stupid by himself for the Jokes.
This might be a hot take but one of my favorite Soras has to be Data Sora. I know he's not really Sora, but I found this take a lot more compelling then most Soras.
Never thought about Data Sora, but you’re absolutely right! I love Data Sora, especially the final segment where he meets Naminé.
Happy to hear their adding another scenario writer to the team. The writing in NEO:TWEWY was pretty enjoyable for me so I hope she can pick up the slack of the more recent games. Though there's no saying how much influence she'll have in the end.
I'm still not sure how to feel about the whole Missing-Link game, but I guess I'll just have to wait and see. I feel like the perspective we've gotten of everything has changed a lot in the years since UX first launched. I still don't know how to feel over DR's revelation that most worlds have just come back to being recently and don't really have centuries of history of existing separately. With the new revelation that ML takes place 4 Generations after Ephimire's rebuilding of the keyblade society makes me wonder how far in the past UX really was. Everything feels less spread-out then I personally would have wanted.
Same. Turns out that "ancient times" weren't ancient at all and Luxu shouldn't have needed more than 10-ish vessels.
AR829038
April 27, 2022 @ 10:05 pmOffline